Perhaps it is because I finally listened to Watch the Throne. Or perhaps it is because I have been writing about Beyonce on this blog for what, three years now. Perhaps it is because I am smack dab in the middle of researching Black women’s sexuality. Perhaps it is because I hear Janelle Harris in the back of my head saying that being married with a baby is the way to go because doing it alone alone is too much work.
I have come to the conclusion that I don’t believe Beyonce.
I think it is the gap between how patriarchal “If you like it you should have put a ring on it” is, and the lack of public intimacy that I have been thinking about this week.
Now here is the thing with writing about pop culture. I know that in taking on people’s beloved artists there is a possibility that they will shut down, cover their ears, and sing lalalalalalalalalalalalaal like a four year old. If you go that route, keep your comments to your self. This is grown shit we are speaking on.
Yes, Beyonce is attractive, talented, hard working, focused and driven. She can perform her ass off. I get that.
But what I also know is that the ways in which she normalizes patriarchy for Black girls need to be interrogated. When I say patriarchy I mean idea that men/masculine people have the right and the power do dominate women and children. For example, patriarchy normalizes lots of janky things like the right for men make more than women for the same work; the right for men take up more space on the train; the right for men to stand on the sidewalk and not move when they see us coming; the right to not clean up shit in the house because it’s women’s work; the right to seek and desire pleasure without being called a failed man; the right for men to be active and women to be passive.
A Black woman who seeks and desires pleasure is called spoiled. Spoiled food is ruined, inedible. It will make you sick.
Being a Black woman with a healthy dating life, I realized that the reason why I don’t believe Beyonce, is that I have never seen her hug her #husbear in public. No hug, no kiss, no face grab.
No passion.
Now on That’s My Bitch, which is song on Jay-Z’s and Kanye’s new album Watch the Throne Jay-Z raps about her, with out “really” rapping about her saying,
Go harder than a nigga for a nigga, gofigure
Told me keep my own money if we ever did split up
How could someone so gangsta be so pretty in pictures
Ripped jeans and a blazer and some Louboutin slippers
Picasso was alive he woulda made her
That’s right nigga, Mona Lisa can’t fade her
I mean Marilyn Monroe, she’s quite nice
But why all the pretty icons always all-white?
Put some colored girls in the MOMA
Half these broads ain’t got nothing on Wylona
Don’t make me bring Thelma in it
Bring Halle, Bring Penelope and Selma in it
Back to my Beyoncés, you deserve three stacks word to Andre
Call Larry Gagosian
You belong in museums, you belong in vintage clothes crushing the whole building
You belong with niggas who used to be known for dope dealin’
You too dope for any of those civilians
Now shoo children, stop lookin’ at her t*ts
Get your own dog, ya heard
That’s my b**ch
So, if I have this correct, she is his Bitch, well kinda. She belongs to niggas known for dope dealing?
According to her, if he liked it, then he would have put a ring on it.
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But I ain’t never seen you kiss this man. Evar. Grab his face. Smack his ass. Something Gina.
I don’t believe you.
Now, @cervantes left a comment questioning my evidence and he has a point. Both Beyonce and Jay have referred to each other publicly. He is correct in that Jay Z has mention her, and she him, publicly. And I will acknowledge this corrective in my post because this is in fact important and significant. However, isn’t there something to be said about the distinction between a public mention, and public affection when you make your bread saying that “You are a success if he gives you a ring”. Why is success measured by having a marriage contract?
I think the post on Clutch by Janelle Harris has influenced me as well. Harris states that while folks living together may be great for some people, for her, she understands the importance of getting married before you have children having had a child 12 years ago and another nine months ago. Harris believes that,
So now, after besting 12 years of single motherhood and nine more months on top of that of being a baby mama, I see now that there is a reason why you should wait to be married before you have little ones. This ish ain’t easy solo. Not that having a husband makes life a cakewalk, but if you’ve picked the right dude, you’ve got a partner to help shoulder and share the responsibilities that come with being a parent, a homeowner—heck, an adult in general.
To them and others who just don’t think it’s that deep, first comes love, second comes marriage, then comes the lady with the baby carriage is a rhyme that didn’t mean much more beyond the playground in elementary school. But to me, it’s the natural order of things, the way the good Lord intended them to be, the modus operandi that makes the most logical sense.
The way God intended? Girrrl, God intended me to be free and to be of service.
Waaaay back in November 2010, my fellow Crunkfeminist @Moyazb stated in response to the No Wedding No Womb meme and the Eddie Long church and sexual violence allegations that,
Perhaps black folks’ ambivalence about marriage signals problems with the institution itself and not with black people.
We are not taught think about how there may be an issue with the institution of marriage rather than with Black people.We are not thinking about other ways to think about family BECAUSE raising children is hella work because doing it alone can lead to a nervous breakdown.
So, if Beyonce is going to be Black women’s ambassador for heterosexual marriage, then ya’ll need to go back to the drawing board.
Can we believe a Love that can’t and won’t be claimed publicly? Especially when the “Love” is constantly referred to, implicitly, in songs.
For GLBTQ folks, claiming your Love publicly can get your assed fired, get you beat on the street, get you kicked out of your biological family. Talk about relationship politics.
Or perhaps their marriage is crude and public example of what marriage in the United States, an economic, legal and property arrangement.
This is why I also believe that folks had such a hard time with the Kim Kardashian’s divorce. Her marriage and divorce exemplified just how much market forces, how much money plays a role in marriage in 2011.
Many of us romantics have a hard time accepting this. But it’s real. As real as that $3.15 latte I just bought. As real as the 35 million people in this country who are on food stamps.
Money matters in our sexual relationships. If you don’t believe me, ask a sex worker or a stripper. Ask the wife of a man who is a millionaire.
I do agree with Janelle on one thing. She states that,
Celebrities wield such heavy influence over what so many folks do, say and believe—including adults, so let’s not front—that Mrs. Carter’s decision to do it the right way (yep, I intentionally left the quotation marks off) just might spark a positive trend.
It is for this reason that I write this piece.
Do you believe Beyonce?
If you refer to your relationship in songs, and if your songs are patriarchal, do you then need to visibly affectionate in order to be believable?
Perhaps patriarchy closes off the space to be affectionate?
Is it meaningful that he put a ring on it but I/we ain’t never seen him kiss her?
#I just wrote my ass off. #Drops mic.
Parenting partnered or or without a partner is HARD WORK. The difference between them is not 1 adult vs. 2 adults or how hard the work is. It’s simply the differences in “hard”, relative to your life choices. I’m a single mother, going on 18 years now. I’ve parented in my own parents’ house with their support and it was hard. I have parented with my ex-husband and it was HARD. I have parented ALONE and it was HARD. I don’t know where this idea of parenting being so much more manageable with MORE adults around came from. We’ve all heard about the “too many cooks in the kitchen” thing, right? When it comes to parenting with a lot of people involved, it can get like that sometimes. You have to do a lot of communicating and compromising and that’s something that we humans absolutely fuck up at times. Yes, you (presumably) have more resources available when you parent with a partner or within your own family of origin than as a single person, that doesn’t make it easier. It just means the currency in which you deal is DIFFERENT. After having experienced 3 of the main ways that Black Mothers mother their children over the course of nearly 20years, I can earnestly say with NO REGRETS, I prefer going at it alone. Not because it’s better, but because this is the “Hard” I’m good at.
As for Jay & Beyonce, I think they seem to like each other which is a bonus when entering into any kind of business contract, right?
*walks out*
I see where you are going w/your argument. And I am not a Bey or Jay stan. But… why do they have to prove anything to you?
That’s the main thing that I don’t get about your article. Nobody should have to prove their love or marriage to you. Only to each other…
I’ve been battling with a similar question for a couple of months now in my own dating relationships. are “public displays of affection” actual for public consumption or are they private [intimate?] moments that just happen to be expressed in a public environment? what does engaging in the private [intimate?] moments in public say about the relationship? what doesn’t engaging in these moments say about the relationship?
is it all political?
are relationships political? are elationships [supposed to be] intentional? are relationships [supposed to be] directed by desire?
with all that said and asked, can one not make the political and intentional choice to be private with their private [intimate?] moments and still be passionate? is the only way to display passion through the public display of affection? even if that public display isn’t for public consumption?
i hope i am making sense.
i guess the bottom line is, if we are to deconstruct the myth that “traditional” marriage is the ultimate achievement of “romance” and “intimacy”, especially when promoted by public figures, we must consume and examine their private [intimate?] lives?
i just worry that those who choose to be private
publically, who aren’t public figures, might could be called on the same ish.
I have care about Black people in general and Black women in particular. As a cultural critic and writer, it is my job to use what I have learned to get us to see how we treat each.
Which leads me to the gap between what she says and what I see and the idea that “if he liked it he should have put a ring on it” being fucked up for Black women and men to have to adhere too.
The messages that we hear in the mainstream are powerful because they teach us what is normal.
As a person who has been privilege to learn how to see and communicate, I see it as MY job get all of us thinking.
Was that responsive?
When Jay & Bey make their living preaching to us about realness of their love and are high-profile personalities both on and off stage, it comes off as a fraud when they come out and only seem to “like each other a whole lot”. Public figures and (sadly) role models for a lot of Black Girls/Boys, living BEYOND well off the stories they feed the masses over those beats do need prove something to me.
@Joshua
All relationships are not equal in the eyes of the public.
As a Black girl who see’s her self as free, I deal with hella consequences every time assert my freedom. Freedom is also contagious.
Relationships ARE political because they have to do with social power between individuals. Different people have differing amounts of social power based on skin, gender, sex, sexual identity, income, education, Blar, Blar, Blar.
I can’t tell you what is right for you.
I know that I AM going to assert my humanity, and get Loved on.
i guess the bottom line is, if we are to deconstruct the myth that “traditional” marriage is the ultimate achievement of “romance” and “intimacy”, especially when promoted by public figures, we must consume and examine their private [intimate?] lives?
============
This statement fails to take into consideration that fact that SHE makes her bread talking about him; that a significant part of her identity is as his lady.
It would be different if she just went about her merry little way and took her Hollywood jobs, and sang about, I dunno, mascara or lip gloss or fancy trips.
“If You Like It Then You Should Have Put a Ring On It” is a cultural phenomenon and it was bugged out to me, when I realized this week that she is not affectionate towards him.
I don’t believe it.
Beyonce and Jay-Z don’t claim their love publicly?
What about all of the interviews (With Funk Flex, with Angie Martinez, on the Letterman show, etc.) where he does openly talk about her, or her thanking him when she accepts awards ?
If there has been no PDA, it doesn’t follow to say that they don’t claim their love publicly.
As for why is it that there’s little/no PDA, maybe that’s just the nature of who they really are, especially Jay. He’s emotionally reserved, you can tell that from his music (he doesn’t have any songs that involve roses and chocolates and laying a woman down and making sweet sweet love all night long, for instance); that doesn’t necessarily mean he isn’t passionate. That just means it’s not the sort of thing he wants to put out there for the world to see. My father is the same way, whereas I’m the hopeless romantic poet type. It would make sense for their to be celebrity couples who could, in this regard, represent the both of us.
Jay and Beyonce did a lot to keep their relationship on the low for a very long time (read: years). So the fact that we don’t see them kissing a lot in public seems more likely to just be a continuation of them not wanting their relationship to be too much of a public spectacle, as opposed to lacking passion.
Even if there was lots of PDA between the two, does that equate to true passion and real love? What about what’s going on in the home, day in and day out? We never could and never will be able to see what that part of a relationship should/could look like from looking at celebrities. For that reason, I believe celebrity relationships should at best only have tertiary or secondary influence on everyone else’s ideals about healthy relationships/marriages.
I’ve never seen Michelle Obama smack the president’s ass either. Aside from a few pecks on the lip/cheek from time to time (which is pretty much all we see of Jay/Beyonce as well), we don’t see the President and the First Lady being [physically] passionate either. Are we to question the passion in their relationship too? Sure, given their positions, there’s much more of an expectation to NOT see that sorta thing… but I bring them up to show how there can very well be lots of passion without any/much PDA.
I am a big fan of both artists (read: so there’s what might be considered my bias), but that said, I’m not writing this in defense of them so much as I’m countering some of the premises in the argument as it is presented here. I think it’s certainly worthwhile to ask the types of questions you’re asking… should we believe Beyonce? But after reading this, I’m not so sure that I shouldn’t.
Look at all the women who did it the right way, such as myself, and still ended up doing 90% of the work. I say marriage masks the imbalance of gendered work. It’s about money. Having two incomes instead of one but doing the same work of a single parent. That’s what people are applauding; that you’re not poor. So this is about something else other than love. After 11yrs, I’m divorcing. It wasn’t the golden ticket. It didn’t help me. It didn’t love me by making things equal, it just became a tool of patriarchy. So it’s done. That’s when you see the instition is broken, when we say to women that they’re lucky to land a good guy who helps. It shouldn’t be luck that determines how much work is shared. No matter how progressive the guy is, there’s still too much in the structure that says it’s women’s work. There’s so much research on marriage that shows women are happier after divorce, but where’s that in the news. I have to study it at a university to get access to the research. Hummm. Higher Ed is a gatekeeper to knowledge.
Kandirra just told the whole truth.
Damnnnn Gina.
I think you get at something, that I didn’t have words to articulate. In some ways I am motivated to write this because a narrative that says that “Black mommas who have babies without being married” ain’t shit is dead wrong. This piece is a corrective to that.
A system that pays you too little for working 60 hours a week is dead wrong.
But the fact that you took it there with your personal life. Let’s just say that I appreciate your honesty.
*nods*
i understand. i sometimes forget that media literacy
is not something we all have and just because *certain* public figures don’t have influence on my private life doesn’t mean they don’t have influence on the private lives of others.
the private lives of the “collective” who are already trying to shame and dictate my private life.
*nods*
i have to work on being more conscious of the social ramifications of “pop success” and not just focus on it from a industry stand point.
i sometimes be forgettin’ the layers.
*nods*
@Kandirra
you just busted it wide open for me.
a WHOLE new layer of conciseness to be open to
and aware of.
transparency saves lives.
#mhm
And the fact that Josh & Renina are so floored by Kandirra’s statements is very indicative of the patriarchal power of marriage, even in so-called modern day marriage. I lived it too. But because I had already lived as a Single Mama for some time before I got married, it didn’t take me 11 years to figure out that I didn’t need marriage (to an unwilling partner) to do the EXACT SAME thing I had already been doing on my own.
I divorced after 2 years. I wasn’t even about that life.
Beyonce is just like those girls who date for status . She is the pretty cheerleader who dates the star player. She really loves him and would do anything for him, but the feelings are not mutual. He has an image to project/protect too. He can’t be with the hood girl he really likes with all that money and status. She is most likely doing everything he tells her like Vanessa Bell Calloway in Coming to America. Being groomed from a young age to have your self worth tied to your looks and talent is damaging for any girl. How else would you allow your man / husband to call you a BITCH as a term of endearment for all to witness. Yes I believe her, she loves her husband and would do anything for him, but I’m not to sure about him.
On the topic of marriage, most people now a days have no clue what marriage really is and those that do , don’t . Our society nowadays is very selfish and is about me me me . Sad.
@Cervantes,
Thank you for your comment.
I am a cultural critic who writes about Pop Culture and Black women.
This week, I began to see that there was a disconnect between “If you like it, you should have put a ring on it” and their lack of affection towards each other in public.
CNN, The Wall Street Journal, Steve Harvey, Stanford Law Professors and Yale Sociologists have all had a lot to say about why aren’t Black women getting married.
Or getting married before having a child IS the “right way to go.”
You are correct, in that Jay Z has mention her, and she him, publicly. And I will aknowledge that in my post because that is in fact important and significant. However, isn’t their something to be said about the distinction between a public mention, and public affection when you make your bread saying that “You are a success if he gives you a ring.”
When you rap, implicitly about your wife, as your bitch?
I write from a very particular location of someone who is invested in debunking the idea that if you don’t have a ring, you are a failure. I would like for us to rethink marriage, and rethink families because the way we go about doing it now ain’t healthy for Black girls, and women.
~R
The article is disjointed. It would have been well served by an outline. It is more a potpourri of ideas than a cohesive unit that leaves the reader with a clear idea of your argument. The connections you attempt to make between Beyonce’s marriage and 50 other things are weak and unsupported (or at least not supported here). Lastly, who cares if you don’t believe Beyonce? Your belief in a marriage does not qualify it.
@Andria
There are a LOT of my ideas in this post about Beyonce. I state my assumptions about her, as many long time readers know here What Sarah Palin Taught Me About Beyonce.
What do you think my argument is? It’s fine if you disagree. But you need to understand the argument before you can legitimately disagree with it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BC-4HwRDyoI&feature=player_detailpage#t=67s
“They love it when I’m hard on hoes
They said a G don’t give a bitch no keys or security codes
I agree, my lady ain’t no bitch, she gets whatever I own
So when you see her, understand that’s me nigga
Understand, I’m the same ol’ G, nigga
I know the difference between a bitch and a Bey, nigga”
Also: Jay-Z – Bitches & Sisters http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qs6hNMEYQMc
Literally taken at face value, Jay’s use of ‘bitch’ in the verse you quoted would be inconsistent with his use of the word in the songs I’ve mentioned. Perhaps he is irrationally self-contradictory… OR, perhaps his use of the word ‘bitch’ is a bit more complex, and isn’t necessarily equivalent to something demeaning.
That said, even I still wish he would’ve gone about it differently in that song and used some other word, so as to not allow for any confusion.
I most definitely agree that we, as American, and as black folks, need to rethink marriage. And if we’re gonna bring Beyonce into the picture (and we should considering her status as a role model for some), then I most definitely agree that we ought to to challenge the notion of having a ring (necessarily) equals success.
As @Kandirra shows us, it doesn’t.
Yes I believe her. Just because they aren’t acting like Will and Jada, making out on red carpets and all, that doesn’t make their marriage fake.
My parents weren’t for PDA, but when they were home, they couldn’t keep their hands of each other. How do you know that’s not the case with Shawn and Beyonce Carter? And Beyonce is a traditional southern girl, as am I. So, even though she is modern and independent, she still has the upbringing that the man is in charge of the household and that you should make him feel like a king, IF he deserves it.
Damn Gina…I mean…Martin….Lol.
This is what I am getting at.
“They love it when I’m hard on hoes They said a G don’t give a bitch no keys or security codes I “…OUCH… Its like that classic Rap contradiction….where I hear the beat and see the crowd, then I listen and be like Dannng…did he really have to say that. Well yes. He did.
Also, thank you for your comment earlier. You helped me to see that I DO in fact see a difference between being affectionate and acknowledging the person. I wasn’t clear about that difference in my first edit of this post.
@cervantes
Re- The B word being demeaning. I argue for a strong reading.
For example, lets to race instead of gender here.
Could a White person say the N word in a “less demeaning way?” No, right?
Well, if that is the case, why should Jay be allowed to say the B word in a “less demeaning” way? Your logic would assume that by sharing the same skin color he gets a special privilege. If this isn’t the assumption there has to be one here for it to work differently.
I didn’t rock with this logic way back when Snoop used it to defend himself against IMUS criticisms and it doesn’t work now.
Thoughts?
I freaking agree Beyonce is so unbelievable regarding love b.c the only time I’ve seen remotely a kiss is on paparazzi photos and they are never kissing they are just about to kiss or real close HUH? Could be they are both shy in public but NEVER anything she doesn’t even hang on him like some one who is head over heels. But that’s me.
Parenting. I think with the right one parenting should be less work on one person but I don’t know if that negates it from being HARD. Even with the right one it doesn’t mean their experiences will allow them to be a great parent. Hmmm….interesting thought tho.
You could also make the case that almost no black couples ever get down like that in public with the exception of Will & Jada and the POTUS & his boo, Michelle. In both cases, the displays of affection are extensions of their performative roles – as actors or as examples.
There are almost no real representations of any kind of intimacy between black people in public because most of us have been trained to know that folks think we’re oversexed and improper anyway. Somebody like Beyonce must always be aware of her brand, and smacking her boo on the ass might be something she talks about on songs or infers, but that ain’t in the Southern Black Ladyhood handbook.
I am not a fan of beyonce and I used to be a fan of jay-z’s but then he married the queen creole and then yeah… My whole thing is why does beyondce have to stand for anything? She is simply a barbie who changes wigs, make-up, costume’s, and green screen lighting techniques, in front of her wind machine. She is a concept that someone fine tuned and marketed the hell out of. They studied the past icon’s well took bits and pieces and made the puzzle fit beyondece. She is really a marginal singer, and she can’t act worth spit. I personally don’t care what anyone say’s I think she is highly overrated and a waste of pr. Now do I think that what her and her alleged husband has is real? Do I think that in their own space she is the typical wife? I think that when she is not entertaining the world when she strips off all the glamour and the theatrics I think she is just that awkward Houston girl who is not very smart but she has that girl next door innocent charm about herself. I think it is good that she married someone with a razor sharp mind and the touch of Midas when it comes to business ventures. Do we have to believe that their marriage is conventional no we don’t all we have to believe is that she is madly in love with him and that he is in love with her but they don’t flaunt it. They create their own world of bliss is what their silence tells us, how many vacation pictures do they have to release, I think for anyone’s relationship to survive in the limelight you have to have a tough defense and that’s what they have they don’t share it with the world they let you speculate all you want but they’re not going to give you anything to feed the flames with. They aren’t obligated too because at the end of the day when they get in the same bed assuming they sleep together they not inviting us in between their sheets.
http://www.vibe.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/image-full-size/images/b.jpg
I just don’t see how this is much different than slut shaming, though? Like obviously it’s a little different, but to rag on Beyonce’s relationship from the outside seems sort of petty, for lack of a better word. Even the pictures you posted show them being pretty affectionate in a few of them.
Overall I think there are a lot of good points here about relationships and patriarchy, but there are a lot of seemingly bitter undertones focused in the wrong direction, imo.
I found this and you’re first piece (What Sarah Palin Taught Me) to be very intriguing and evocative. Evocative because while dealing with a similar set of issues in my own work I don’t reach all of the same conclusions.
I for example am not as convinced as you seem to be at the weight that hegemony plays specifically in Black- U.S. based popular culture. I think that like all forms of culture, Black people have through necessity been trained to have an oppositional consciousness towards the media that they encounter. This oppositional consciouness has not, I believe, died with the advent of mass distribution of Black images. And in this I’m riffing off the work of Jacqueline Bobo.
I make this point because I feel that you’re expression of Beyonce as dangerous to young girls’ (and grown women’s) understanding of relationships, marriage, and patriarchy I see similar tendencies toward work that warns against the dangers of the “loose” woman image in popular culture. For me these arguments tend to unfold as such: We must save young Black women from X image because they will believe it is true, the only possibility of being, and/or become it by consuming it.
I think it’s dangerous ground to equate consumption with identification (though I acknowledge that there are many scholars and critics who believe that this how identity works in the era of global capitalism.) I would point to the work of queer of color scholars on disidentification and counteridentification (particularly Joze Munoz) for conversations on how one can consume images/artificacts that either don’t reflect themselves or their values without necessarily becoming convinced by those images/artifacts.
All that to say that I believe that culture is at its worst a co-conspirator of oppressive regimes. That while media does send messages about the nature of life to people, young Black girls, that we are capable of more sophisticated and nuanced relationships than we at times give credit. And I don’t mean after being “trained” in media literacy. I mean that every day we (re)learn how to understand the images/artifacts that we encounter. I don’t believe that people act in the ways they do because they have been duped by cultural products. Instead I believe it is a messy interweaving of discourse, individual and group psychology, social opportunity, and history. Scapegoating culture production I think leaves us without out anyway to hold accountable the structural forces and personal and group complicity with oppressive regimes. Rappers did not teach me about patriarchy and the domination of Black women by Black men…my father did.
So ultimately it doesn’t matter, to me, whether or not Beyonce and Jay-Z marriage is real. Whatever a real marriage is supposed to be. For me what the public’s unease about the authenticity of their marriage reflects is a national and more specifically Black people’s long sordid anxieties about what marriage means. Particularly important to U.S.-based notions of marriage in the 20th century is the attempt through law and cultural production to create a rule of marriage as a romantic partnership between two opposite gender individuals. Part of the purpose of the creation of such a rule was to separate “American” marriage from ‘foreign’ and ‘ethnic’ (and I am attempting to connote what was a pejorative concept of both terms) notion of marriage that was seen as being basely economic in it’s reasoning. (This argument is based largely in my readings of Pamela Haag and Katherine Franke on race, post-emancipation , immigration, and marriage.) Ultimately America has always been afraid of thinking of marriage as the economic institution that I believe it to be. Marriages that starkly bring that into the public milieu often excite this anxiety. A condition of our acceptance into American society has been Black people’s investment into this ethical anxiety about marriage (Franke.)
I feel the same way about Bey-Z as I do Kim Kardashian’s marriage, I am only as concerned about it to the extent that everyone else seems to find it so anxiety provoking. This isn’t to say that public figures, and celebrities are who we’re talking about right now specifically, are beyond the bounds of critic or observation. I make my living largely based on doing just that. However, what I am saying is that our observations and criticism need to think of these things with a consideration of the historical context which they are found within. As other’s have mentioned there are many contemporary and historical examples of Black marriage/relationships/love that don’t fit within the affection rubric that you’re outlining in the above piece.
It’s popped into my head that there is an interesting relationship between the way you have described Beyonce in this work and some of the charges that Condoleezza Rice has often faced for seeing cold and detached. And while I’m probably the last person to launch a defence of Condy campaign, I ultimately think this policing of her affective displays was ultimately a way for both Black and whites to question her femininity, moral character (which there were soo many other policy related ways of doing THAT), and her authentic human being-ness. I am brought to this comparison largely by your repeated invocation of Beyonce’s class status (as now wealthy and formerly middle class–which is suggested by you’re comment that she grew up in the suburbs of Houston, which is inaccurate in my opinion as I’m from the area she was born in (I went to the neighboring high school that she, kind-of attended) and it was hardly a suburb much less a Black middle class area. This image of the aloof and austere middle class Black woman, I’m thinking Sanai in Somethings Gotta Give, is an enduring cultural trope of the last 50 years at least in Black cultural production and I think it deserves much more consideration.
I’m going to tr to wrap up because I think I’ve probably over stayed my welcome at this point. I guess my though is *of course* there is artifice in how Beyonce does or does not display affect in public. That is ultimately a part of the lives of all Black women. There is often an unusual burden of such artifice placed on the bodies and movements of professional and public Black women (I’m thinking here of the work of Darlene Clark Hine and cultures of dissemblance.) That is not to say that working class, poor, and the everday Black women don’t enact this artifice either. Nor am I arguing that this is healthy. I think that dissemblance is a historical trauma that reeks havoc on the psyches of Black women constantly. However, I am arguing I guess that this is not a phenomenon that was started by Beyonce, nor is she the most important or powerful actor in this issue.
*I would also like to say that if her career is looked at in the fullness of it’s development that there is, I believe, a distinct shift in the ways that she is able to talk about sex, love, and desire after the dismissal of Matthew Knowles as her manager (and in large part constructor of her public image) which is most visible in the, I think, sea change between the albums I am…Sasha Fierce and 4. Where Beyonce goes from singing about putting rings on it and instead to treating her husband to erotic dances.
**I’m going to post this to my blog and link back to your piece. I will take down the link if you request.
Here is the link to my posting at my blog:
http://hiphopenthusiast.blogspot.com/2011/11/real-bey-z-marriage-affect-and-politics.html
Feel free to comment there or here or at my tumblr (the website listed here.)
Peep Game:
I believe Beyonce is in love with Jay. She tries so hard to elevate him publicly. She refers to him as a genius and talks about feeling privileged to be present when Jay did A or B.
Jay-Z on the other hand is always cool about Beyonce. There’s never more than a half smile towards her. Curiously, he refers to her in superficial ways (beauty, talent) rather than intimate ways (kind, generous, sexy). Their relationship is artfully executed for the cameras but their body language speaks to a different reality at home.
Bottom Line!
Lots to think about in this post. I never analyzed Bey’s r’ship because like Hosh, I don’t particularly idolize the behavior of public figures (with the exception of the Obamas; I think they’re pretty cool). Upon reflection, the complete lack of PDA is unusual because even the most low key couples get close to each other or occasionally touch. But even more than that, where is the loving gaze? Bey clearly lights up in the face when she talks about Jay. But I haven’t seen any interviews where he talks about her so I don’t know if that bit of speculation is even correct. Also, I have a fondness for PDA so I’m a bit biased.
As far as marriage goes–the institution isn’t perfect, but the economic benefits can’t be denied. Taxes, insurance, legitimation, etc. That doesn’t mean there is no place for love though. I don’t think it’s marriage in and of itself that is the problem, but rather the ideas of it that people bring into it. There are very few women who are content to be 1950s style housewives. And unfortunately, when women agitated for equal rights they ended up taking on traditionally male roles & burdens IN ADDITION TO traditionally female roles & burdens, rather than redefining gender roles altogether. So as a woman, it’s very important to talk about these things with your partner. As a man, it’s important to realize how much privilege your maleness gives you and be willing to relinquish it for the health of your relationship.
@GogoJojo
Thank you for taking the time to respond.
I will respond below and ask some questions.
For a couple, I posted my response below your comment for clarity’s sake.
I know Bobo’s work really well. In particular Black Women as Cultural readers. I am also familiar with Munoz’s idea of disidentification.
What evidence do you have that main stream audiences are “reading Beyonce against the grain?”similar to the women in Bobo’s “Black Women as Cultural Readers”?
How can hegemony NOT play a role in shaping the images that we see AND shaping the tools that we have to deconstruct them? Black women do not earn $70-$80M/for one years work unless they are helping the 1% keep their OWN money and make more.
Perhaps the issue also here is also who gets to create which images and why?
This is not to say that there isn’t space for Beyonce’s work being read against the grain, because there is. But this space is on the margins. Not the center. Peoples responses to *this* blog post serve as evidence of the consequences of reading Beyonce’s work “against the grain” publicly.
Think about it this way. I can write about this on my blog but would Essence run it? Probably not? Why, because for many Black women, especially heterosexual identified women, working, developing a career getting married THEN getting pregnant is THE narrative to follow.
To run my words is in some way to validate the fact that my critique is legitimate.
Why would Essence do that and would their audience like it? I don’t see why they would, and I don’t see how their audience could like it. It would force them to rethink marriage and family and that is some life changing, society changing ‘ish.
I make this point because I feel that you’re expression of Beyonce as dangerous to young girls’ (and grown women’s) understanding of relationships, marriage, and patriarchy I see similar tendencies toward work that warns against the dangers of the “loose” woman image in popular culture.
==========
I am invested in relclaiming pleasure for Black girls. So….I am not sure how me policing them has come across.
My recent work on Black girls and pleasure speaks to this.
I am ALSO invested in interrogating patriarchy in BOTH R&B and RAP music and I have been doing so for years on my blog. Perhaps it’s the public critique of patriarchy in Beyonce’s music that makes it look like I am policing Black women’s sexualities.
I hope this was responsive.
~R
No, I don’t think they need to be visibly affectionate in order for me to believe that they really care for one another.
I dont’ think its necessarily a contradiction that they only show affection through music BUT I’ve always disliked the disparity in the music about “each other.” I wanted for Jay to put out an LL Cool J like rap song about how he feels/loves her not about how proud he is to be with the hottest chick in the game.
With that said, I also think the two of them have always been about making money and making art that appeals to the widest audiences possible. And truthfully, art that confirms society’s stereotypes sells better up front, so they mold themselves into the most marketable forms of masculinity and femininity.
I have conflicting emotions about my image of the couple – sometimes I think its great, I applaud her ability to look beneath the surface and find a compatible mate – other times I sneer because I know a relationship where their looks were reversed would be very very unlikely to occur.
I ask – why am I – the woman – always expected to close my eyes – to so many things from behavioral traits to looks to finances.
One more thing…..
I think the way that the Knowles-Carters are also presenting their relationships in the way to be most palatable to most people.
In America, we think it is natural for the man to choose a woman to boost his status,
meanwhile if a woman is perceived to do the same thing – choosing a guy for his money, it is very much frowned upon. Instead she should just feel lucky that she has a guy.
Women are meant to service men. period.
Some really interesting comments. Just to state briefly which I haven’t seen mentioned, I feel like Jay Z puts Beyonce on this untouchable pedestal. Like she’s some kind of monument, painting. Something untouchable and thus unreal.
As a young black woman, I’m kind of tired of this ceaseless portrayal of what is perfect. I’m supposed to be everything. Not take a shit. Be an idyllic mother, wife, smart (but not too smart). Business woman, homemaker.
I think that in a nutshell is my problem with Beyonce and Jay Z. They can do whatever they want with their relationship, but maybe if their projected relationship didn’t seem to check every stereotype box for the ridiculous levels of perfection that black women are supposed to meet, I wouldn’t feel so bored with Beyonce, or stressed out at the image that I am supposed to live up to.
History shows that black women have been squeezed into all kinds of boxes, from slut to angel. Sexless to full of sex. When do we get to talk about the “real” black woman in the media? Imperfect, but strong. Beautiful, sometimes sexy, sometimes not?
Beyonce simply re-cycles the wheel in her image and in her outward relationship with Jay Z. It’s monolithic and unbelievable (without invading her privacy as to how she in fact operates her relationship, which is none of anyone’s business).
But that image that she puts forward? That, ladies and gentlemen, is absolutely my business when it seeps into everything I do, especially when people assume that they understand who I am as a black woman because they only have people like Beyonce on one hand and those lunatics on Real Housewives etc. to compare me to.
i have never been married, but i did spend the first three years of my daughter’s life parenting alone in my parent’s house, and her fourth year parenting with her father in an apartment that we shared, and the change in dynamic DID make a differnce in my workload and level of exhaustion. it did. i don’t think that marriage is a panacea, particularly if people don’t iron out their own patriarchal notions of marriage or define for themselves what they want their unique partnership to be. however, i don’t think that we should write marriage off, either, and the balancing effect it can have on women’s lives if it is allowed to. two incomes in a home, two people taking responsibility for chores and childrearing, and two people helping each other shoulder the psychological and emotional weight of being black in america can be a beautiful, POWERFUL thing if the two bring a certain level of consciousness, conscientiousness, and plain ol’ conscience to the table. i do not believe in a woman seeking some man’s seal of approval through the bestowal of materialistic symbols and emblems (i.e. a ring on it, but i don’t think there is anything wrong with seeking a partner who will be an equal and honest help to you. i strongly suspect that the women who have commented about their unsuccessful marriages did little more on the front end of their weddings than bask in the glow of their solitaire diamonds. i get that. i was raised on fairy tales and rom-coms. however, as grown women, feminists, whatever we call ourselves, we have to acknowledge how much intellectual, political, and spiritual work goes into forming a good marriage. we have to do it. and we have to pick partners that are willing to do it with us. we don’t have to refute the institution of marriage. we just have to refuse partners that don’t understand or respect it. that’s what i think.
Great post! I linked to you when I wrote about something similar here: “On Heteropatriarchy, Presidents and Families”: http://hiphopcheerleader.blogspot.com/2011/12/on-heteropatriarchy-presidents-and.html
First off. Wow. This post and the comments have made me realise a lot about how I define myself as a woman and why I have such apathy to marriage as I have seen it undertaken around me.
I grew up in a two parent household then with a single mom.Marriage makes economic sense to me. Seeing my mum struggle made me realise this.I lacked because I didn’t have dad to ask when mama didn’t have it. So marriage as a financial arrangement makes total sense to me.
Being a woman in a 3rd world country,my path is defined for me.Daughter,wife,mother. I rebel against that path,choosing instead to define myself as an intellectual vs as a domestic goddess or as whatever my extremely patriachal society sees as the reason to ‘wife it’. The implications of this on dating are far reaching,but basically I need to find a conscious partner who riles against patriachy,a system that gives him hella priviledge and sees me as an equal.
I have so many thoughts on this,but I just have to say thank you for this space,this work.